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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 1:20 pm 
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I live in a house that was built approximately 30 years ago. Two years ago we rented a rototiller machine for two days to break heavy clay soil after we promptly broke two pitchforks in less than 15 minutes. After two days of pouring in manure, sand, lime and top soil, we discovered something more than our backs hurt - the ground was full of concrete chips.

Our corner lot must've been used as the concrete mixing station because the ground is full of it. We tried planting a garden on the spot and found that veggies that came out of it tasted absolutely awful and made us sick. We let the ground go for two more years, but I'm poised to reclaim it for the spring of 2004 and need help.

Currently, I have moved my compost pile over the spot I want to plant on. Since the pile is large, I figure two things will happen - the pile will encourage earth worms and other creepies to break through the soil and inhabit the pile, and if any of the good things leech out of the pile, it'll go directly into the soil, helping to condition it.

What else can I do to help speed up the process and/or to work on the areas where the ground doesn't have the benefit of a compost pile rotting on it?? I'm bound and determined to take back the yard, but need information in order to be successful. Yes, I had thought of bringing in one of those lawn care companies to till and aerate the soil, but that gets expensive and the results don't last too long.


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 Post subject: bad soil
PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 8:50 pm 
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You are on the right track but I would suggest you dig out as much of the concrete as you can and remember in some places they dump all kinds of chemicals into the concrete - mercury being just one. Even fluoride wouldn't surprise me.
Robert D Bard


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 Post subject: Easier methods
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:50 am 
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Location: Dallas,TX
Molasses is your friend. Remember that! Molasses on your compost pile will keep it hot, molasses on your soil will keep the microbes happy. Liquid molasses is the cheapest way to go. After that, compost tea and/or a microbial innoculant will boost your beneficial microbe counts and I'll bet with the contaminants you almost certainly have, you need all the good bugs you can get. If the vegetables made you sick, I'd get a soil test and make sure it is tested for serious toxins. You want to know what it is you ate that made you sick and how much of it is there! Spend the money for a test now and consider it preventive health care. Somebody put something nasty in that soil and if it were to make you really sick you'd want to know what it is and who is responsible, right?

If you have bare soil, mulch it with something. Shredded hardwood would be best but hay, leaves, etc. or any other material you can get in quantity will help. It will stop erosion, keep rain from compacting your soil more and look a whole lot better than mud! :D

Manure is good, but sand, lime and topsoil are things I wouldn't recommend, because of their drawbacks and better alternatives that don't break your back. Like my momma taught me, I don't criticize unless I have a good alternative. :wink: So here's mine:

Buy liquid molasses ($8-$15/gallon) and liquid compost/compost tea ($11-$18/gallon) and/or soil bio-innoculant ($10-$12/various sizes) OR ANY ONE OF THESE THREE and put them on your yard now. They will make the soil more healthy and begin to break down compounds and organic matter in the soil and help it stay warmer and reduce evaporation over the winter. In late February, put out a good organic fertilizer at the coverage level the product recommends and horticultural cornmeal at about 5-10 lbs per thousand square feet. You WILL see improvement.

Hope this helps! :D :D


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 11:18 am 
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soil bio-innoculant ??

Ok, I've entered a whole new world. LOL... Where can I find this?

The concrete....not sure where all of it is, and that'll mean digging up a very large section of the back yard. All that we saw, we picked up and threw at the base of a tree in the backyard so we could keep track of how much came out and where it was so we could throw it away.

As I find it, it meets Mr Trash bin as I can see no value it.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:31 pm 
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Location: Lavon,Texas
destiny3
I have gone thru the same thing with concrete. I have filled up my 96 gallon dumpster three times already with the concrete pieces I have found in the yard. Sometimes I have to break them up, to big to lift, and deposit into the dumpster. The holes that are ledt over I fill with compost until they are filled to the top. It may take 3 - 4 loads of compost on some of the holes.

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Converting one person at a time to Organics, the only way to go!! [ ME ]


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 Post subject: Bio-innoculant
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 1:31 pm 
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Location: Dallas,TX
Welcome to our world! :lol:

Bio-innoculant means a solution that will introduce beneficial microbes into your soil. Most soil has some microbes in it but various factors can deplete the microbe population to the point that it is insufficient to break down nutrients or toxins effectively. So you buy some and put it on the yard to refresh the population and make your soil healthy again. There are several bio-innoculants on the market; Earthworm can be found in Lowe's and is very economical at around $10. You use about a half-ounce to the gallon and put it out on your lawn in a very fine mist. There are millions of microbes in every ounce so a little goes a long way. Compost tea is also a good way to revive your microbe population as most compost teas carry microbes as well as organic matter. Molasses is the sugar to feed them and get them to reproduce rapidly.

Now, is that as clear as mud? :lol: :lol:
Stick around kid! We'll teach you "green speak"!!!!!

Kathe


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 2:58 pm 
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Has anyone heard of "worm castings" or know what they do? I spotted a bag of....whatever they are....at Home Depot in the organic section. There was nothing written on the package as to what they were or how to use them, and I thought, "what the (bleeep!) are worm castings?!?!"

Ok, no wise guys telling me they're making another "Joe's Apartment" style compost flick and it's like a casting call for the beneficials. :lol:

Sorry, you got me thinking when you said the product name was earthworm, and it triggered my memory. :D


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 4:24 pm 
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Location: Lavon,Texas
Earthworm is the name of the product. I bought mine at Lowes in Rockwall. Kathe told us about it, when we were at the church cementary, converting it back to organics, a couple of weeks ago. It peaked my interest. Now I can't wait until spring to try it. I am going to turn my yard, which was a corn field, into a lush green bermuda yard, that needs very little water and care. Just mowing and organic feeding 2 - 3 times a year.
If you are interested in Earthworm, have Kathe explain all about it to you. I know she will be more then happy to do it.

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Greg...
Converting one person at a time to Organics, the only way to go!! [ ME ]


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 4:49 pm 
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Location: Saginaw (NW Fort Worth), Texas
if i am correct worm castings = worm poop.
supposed to be incredibly rich and good for the soil (i think)


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 Post subject: worm poop?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 5:43 pm 
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Is it just me, or can others see "pooper scooper" laws for worms on the horizon? I smell revenue enhancement....

New tax structure....instead of charging by square footage, they'll estimate how many worms you've got on your property and charge you per poop, and then the EPA will want in because you're not properly disposing waste - without licenses and permits obtained, of course. Can you imagine the fines? :shock:

Ok, I've learned something new.....and I'm still debating if I really needed to know that. That'll teach me to be curious! :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 9:46 pm 
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How will the government know how many worms we have? Will they ask us how long we have been organic? Do we tell the truth or say we have just become organic. I hate to have me yard dug up by Government worm diggers just to count. We may have to start an 'Underground Escape System, for the worms. Kinda like the Underground Railroad System. Can you imagine the size of the 'Pooper Scooper you would need. Also who is gona follow the worms around and scoop up the poop?
:?

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Converting one person at a time to Organics, the only way to go!! [ ME ]


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2004 9:53 pm 
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Location: florida
if your soil is that bad you probably will need to do some soil removal!

the concrete will also have the PH way high!

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 Post subject: cement
PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2004 9:43 pm 
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I would leave it there and just build on top of that.. put as much good compost as you can on top and go from there.. one foot, two feet, the more the better..


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2004 9:22 pm 
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destiny 3-
Try raised vegetable garden beds until you have has a chance to employ some of the great advice you have been given. You can use cedar boards or stone products. You have many choices for the fill.
Tony M


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